Comments on: Mr Zaninotto calls it a day.. http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/ Me, myself and Symfony.. Tue, 06 Jan 2009 23:12:27 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: rpsblog.com » A week of symfony #72 (12->18 may 2008) http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-53 rpsblog.com » A week of symfony #72 (12->18 may 2008) Sun, 01 Jun 2008 00:04:50 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-53 [...] Mr Zaninotto calls it a day.. [...] [...] Mr Zaninotto calls it a day.. [...]

]]> By: Ian http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-45 Ian Fri, 23 May 2008 23:02:28 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-45 Francois' whole point is that he is NOT a developer, meaning he cannot and would not want to run his own branch of symfony. I think he is coming from the role of a designer, who has to use the framework in conjunction with developers. I am getting the same criticisms from my designers about 1.1 as Francois is presenting. The new sfForms framework is very powerful, but also very complicated, and in many situations, is overkill. It actually can slow down development instead of speed it up. Aside from the forms (which still are being polished), 1.1 is making a lot of headway. Francois’ whole point is that he is NOT a developer, meaning he cannot and would not want to run his own branch of symfony. I think he is coming from the role of a designer, who has to use the framework in conjunction with developers.

I am getting the same criticisms from my designers about 1.1 as Francois is presenting. The new sfForms framework is very powerful, but also very complicated, and in many situations, is overkill. It actually can slow down development instead of speed it up.

Aside from the forms (which still are being polished), 1.1 is making a lot of headway.

]]> By: Romain Dorgueil (hartym) http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-41 Romain Dorgueil (hartym) Wed, 21 May 2008 07:08:05 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-41 you can even use it (or code it from scratch) without a computer... If that's not real magic, tell me what is :) you can even use it (or code it from scratch) without a computer… If that’s not real magic, tell me what is :)

]]> By: greg http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-40 greg Tue, 20 May 2008 17:01:13 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-40 hartym: The programmers of the sfNadaPlugin know about magic: this is the only plugin I know which is compatible without modification on sf1.0, sf1.1 and the trunk !! hartym: The programmers of the sfNadaPlugin know about magic: this is the only plugin I know which is compatible without modification on sf1.0, sf1.1 and the trunk !!

]]> By: Romain Dorgueil (hartym) http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-39 Romain Dorgueil (hartym) Tue, 20 May 2008 11:53:17 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-39 I don't get it with the 1.0 branch stuff. 1.0 is long term support, and sensio will keep maintenance on it for 3 years. No new features will come in it, but that's a pro, because you're 100% sure all your 1.0 projects will go on working when you upgrade symfony 1.0, and it'll be done painlessly. About Francois leaving the project... I'm a bit sad too, because he's done great work on symfony 1.0 documentation, but as he's himself saying, noone is irreplacable. And I don't know any open source project with no team changes as the project is growing. It does not means that there won't be documentation anymore. 1.1 seems more complex as now, because documentation is not yet ready, but I would not freeze my opinion on this, some surprises may arise soon, who knows? "1 lost, 10 found" as says a french proverb... @greg: sfNadaPlugin seems much more complex in its nadattitude in 1.1 imho.... in fact I feel like I already heard your question recently, I wonder where.... I don’t get it with the 1.0 branch stuff. 1.0 is long term support, and sensio will keep maintenance on it for 3 years. No new features will come in it, but that’s a pro, because you’re 100% sure all your 1.0 projects will go on working when you upgrade symfony 1.0, and it’ll be done painlessly.

About Francois leaving the project… I’m a bit sad too, because he’s done great work on symfony 1.0 documentation, but as he’s himself saying, noone is irreplacable. And I don’t know any open source project with no team changes as the project is growing. It does not means that there won’t be documentation anymore.

1.1 seems more complex as now, because documentation is not yet ready, but I would not freeze my opinion on this, some surprises may arise soon, who knows?

“1 lost, 10 found” as says a french proverb…

@greg: sfNadaPlugin seems much more complex in its nadattitude in 1.1 imho…. in fact I feel like I already heard your question recently, I wonder where….

]]> By: greg http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-36 greg Mon, 19 May 2008 12:47:27 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-36 Naholyr, I have been working a lot with sf1.0 (I am also one of the trainers of the sf1.0) and I have been using sf1.1 for few projects. Could you give me en example of something that exists in sf1.0 and is more complex in sf1.1 ? Naholyr, I have been working a lot with sf1.0 (I am also one of the trainers of the sf1.0) and I have been using sf1.1 for few projects.

Could you give me en example of something that exists in sf1.0 and is more complex in sf1.1 ?

]]> By: naholyr http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-35 naholyr Mon, 19 May 2008 09:03:56 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-35 I agree with François that 1.1 is not taking the right direction, and I think I won't use it before a while : as I said in a previous comment in François's blog, I'm in charge of the formation in my company, and 1.0 was already not always easy to make accepted but they really got the point about "convention over configuration", the really human-readable config files, the "configuration over code", etc... We'll see, but I'd like the 1.0 branch to get its own life and stay on the same philosophy, while 1.1 will keep going more and more complex for "advanced developers" (I consider myself as advanced, but I prefer taking time concentrating on things specific to the project, than things specific to the tool). I agree with François that 1.1 is not taking the right direction, and I think I won’t use it before a while : as I said in a previous comment in François’s blog, I’m in charge of the formation in my company, and 1.0 was already not always easy to make accepted but they really got the point about “convention over configuration”, the really human-readable config files, the “configuration over code”, etc…

We’ll see, but I’d like the 1.0 branch to get its own life and stay on the same philosophy, while 1.1 will keep going more and more complex for “advanced developers” (I consider myself as advanced, but I prefer taking time concentrating on things specific to the project, than things specific to the tool).

]]> By: James http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-32 James Sat, 17 May 2008 11:05:44 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-32 As Francois is not a developer, but a documentation writer, he should team up with a team of developers who are able to maintain the 1.0 branch. I have not yet looked at sf1.1, so I can 't yet conclude that such a move is necessary, but Francois leaving certainly got me worried. As Francois is not a developer, but a documentation writer, he should team up with a team of developers who are able to maintain the 1.0 branch.

I have not yet looked at sf1.1, so I can ‘t yet conclude that such a move is necessary, but Francois leaving certainly got me worried.

]]> By: Hugo http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-31 Hugo Sat, 17 May 2008 10:52:39 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-31 It's a very bad news for the Symfony Project ! I hope Sensio will dedicate more people to follow François Z.'s documentation work. It’s a very bad news for the Symfony Project ! I hope Sensio will dedicate more people to follow François Z.’s documentation work.

]]> By: catchamonkey http://symfonystuff.info/2008/05/16/mr-zaninotto-calls-it-a-day/#comment-30 catchamonkey Fri, 16 May 2008 16:28:35 +0000 http://symfonystuff.info/?p=17#comment-30 I'm hoping this doesn't have the effect on symfony that it could. The docs have helped me through a lot and as you say they are one of the strengths of the framework. Let's hope his departure doesn't mean developers like me are left out in the cold. I’m hoping this doesn’t have the effect on symfony that it could. The docs have helped me through a lot and as you say they are one of the strengths of the framework.
Let’s hope his departure doesn’t mean developers like me are left out in the cold.

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